The Rational Basis® of Happiness Podcast

The Selfish Path to Romance.
Download chapter one for free at DrKenner.com and at Amazon.com.

Hey Niles, Maris found a gray hair.
Captain again, Miles of Randy.
It was right at the apex of her widow's peak.
How to bring the bottle.
She blames me, Dad.
She said it's from the stress I caused her last night when I thoughtlessly turned on the light while she was getting undressed.

One of the hardest things for couples to talk about is their sexual life.
They can joke about it, they can be playful about it, but when they get to trying to make it work with one another, so many resentments build up.
What are the types of problems that couples face?

With me today, I have the pleasure of introducing Dr. Barry McCarthy.
He's a professor of psychology at American University, and he's a certified marital and sex therapist.
So if you've ever asked yourself, "What does a sex therapist do?" — this is where we may get some answers.

He has a private practice in Washington, D.C., and — very unusually — with his wife Emily, he has co-authored eight books on relationships and sexuality, including Rekindling Desire.

Dr. Barry McCarthy, what a pleasure to have an opportunity to talk with you.
I'm glad to be here.

I see a range of couples, couples that come in with a range of problems, and I'm wondering — you know they talk about conflicts over finances, or conflicts over the in-laws, or with the kids, or dividing up household chores — and those are legitimate conflicts.
But sometimes I'm really blown away, actually, by the fact that when you get to the sexual issues, those are underlying all the others — that if their sex life went better, they could actually deal with the in-laws better.
Why is sex so important?

I think that's absolutely true — the role of healthy sex in marriages is to be an energizer, a resource to help you feel re-energized, bonded with each other, and so you can deal with things like finances, kids, and in-laws.
But when you stop being a sexual couple — when sex is less than once a month or twice a month — it becomes very awkward, and it really is a major drain.
You lose that sense of being special and being energized and being attractive to each other.
So it's much more likely that you're going to be struggling with other hard issues.

So it's much harder — if their sex life goes well, a particular couple will be able to weather the storms, and they feel more — as you use the word — bonded with each other.
They feel more important to one another.
And that's one of the great benefits of a great, healthy romantic relationship and a great sex life too.

You mentioned a fact in your book Rekindling Desire, which is that sex adds about 15 to 20% to marital satisfaction.
Now if you're a teenager, you think, "Oh my gosh, I can't wait to get married! Then we can jump in bed and be sexy all day long!"
But you're saying it only adds 15 to 20% of marital satisfaction, but that if it goes bad, it can dynamite a relationship, right?

Right.
And what you want in a good, healthy sexual relationship — and again, a good, healthy sexual relationship means more than just intercourse.
It means touching inside and outside the bedroom.
It means feeling a sense of desire and attraction for each other.
And obviously, intercourse is part of that, but unlike what teenagers think, it's not the major part.

What you want in a healthy sexual relationship is where you use sex as a shared pleasure — as a way of deepening and reinforcing intimacy, and also as a tension reducer to deal with some of the stresses of life: a marriage, two kids, two jobs, two dogs — those kinds of things.

Okay, so sex serves multiple functions — having it go well in a relationship.

I want to turn to erotica right now, because when I listened to you speak — I went to one of your workshops — this is Dr. Barry McCarthy, for those who are listening, and he's written the book Rekindling Desire.

At one of your workshops, you mentioned that most men grow up and they're very used to self-pleasuring, and they're used to erotic techniques, whereas women don't milk that as much as men do.
And that you might think once a couple is married, they can openly explore all sorts of sensual methods — you know, fantasies and erotic scenarios — but they don't.
Why is it equally important for women? And what would you advise women?

Well, I think that as people are married and as they age, men and women become much more similar.
Part of the challenge for women is to value erotic scenarios and techniques.
And the culture — not just women, but our culture — thinks of eroticism as belonging to people who are not married, who are under 20.
They think of sex as something that is hot but gets you into trouble.

What I talk to my female clients about is finding your own sexual voice.
And part of that sexual voice is valuing intimacy.
Part of it is valuing touch and pleasuring.
But another part is, what are the things that are your wants and desires — that really allow you to feel aroused, orgasmic, and really value a couple's sex life.

So there's some individual work to be done first.
A woman needs to ask herself, "What's erotic for me? What turns me on?"

And I know — do that talking to your spouse outside the bedroom.
Rather than trying to do it while you're nude in bed — I think people feel too vulnerable.
A good place to talk sex is over a glass of wine or a cup of tea in the living room or dining room, or on a walk.
And give each other information: What's a turn-on? What's a turn-off?

In your book Rekindling Desire, you mention turn-offs — poisons for sexual desire.
What are some of these that just totally demoralize a couple?

Hey, I gotta interrupt this, because we've got to pay some bills.
30 seconds, that's it.
A very quick ad, and then Ellen will be back.

Romance.
Oh, I wish guys knew more about what we want from a relationship.
Boy, I wish I knew more about what I want.
Where's that ad I saw?

Ah, here it is: The Selfish Path to Romance, a serious romance guidebook.
Download chapter one for free at SelfishRomance.com, and buy it at Amazon.com.

Hmm, The Selfish Path to Romance — that is interesting.

In your book Rekindling Desire, you mention turn-offs — poisons for sexual desire.
What are some of these that just totally demoralize a couple?

Well, probably the major one is where you're feeling angry and alienated from the spouse, or you're feeling very anxious or inhibited.
Or there's something that has happened in your life — whether it was premarital life or otherwise — where you feel ashamed and guilty about it, and think,
"If my spouse knew that about me, they wouldn't love me. They wouldn't care about me."

And again, I think one of the great advantages of an intimate relationship is feeling loved and accepted for all of who you are — your strengths and your vulnerabilities.

And another thing about anger:
The old view was that you can't be sexual if you're angry — you have to express the anger and get over it first.
The new view is a both/and view: that you need to talk about the things that caused you to feel angry — and behind it is usually this feeling of being hurt — outside the bedroom.
But part of the idea of continuing touching and sexuality is that it allows you to stay connected and gives you the energy to deal with the hurt and anger outside the bedroom.

So you want the both/and approach.
You want to be able to identify what are these turn-offs or poisons for sexual desire — and then deal with them better.

If someone wants to read your books, how can they get them? You've written — so you've written eight of them with your wife, Emily McCarthy.

Well, in terms of the desire, probably the most important book is Rekindling Desire.
And you can get it at the bookstore or through Amazon or BarnesandNoble.com.

The book that we're most excited about, actually, is a prevention book.
It's called Getting It Right the First Time: Creating a Healthy Marriage, and we talk about the first two years of marriage.
There are two chapters — there's one chapter specifically about developing a sexual relationship so you don't get into these problems.
The best cure is good prevention.

Okay, that sounds wonderful.

Dr. Barry McCarthy, so, so glad you were able to join me today.
I look forward to talking with you again.

For more Dr. Kenner podcasts, go to DrKenner.com.

And please listen to this ad:

Here's an excerpt from The Selfish Path to Romance, the serious romance guidebook by clinical psychologist Dr. Ellen Kenner:

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You can download chapter one for free by going to DrKenner.com, and you can buy the book at Amazon.com.