The Rational Basis® of Happiness Podcast

The Selfish Path to Romance. Download chapter one for free at DrKenner.com.

Ronald, you're wondering how long to wait before starting a new relationship?

Yes, absolutely.

Yeah, tell me your situation.

Well, I was in a seven-year relationship. There was a lot of verbal and emotional abuse in the relationship.

Which way?

Two-way.

Okay, two-way.

There’s a five-year-old child involved in the relationship, okay?

Relationship, yeah. And the relationship just ended maybe about a month ago, and I’m concerned whether or not I should move into another relationship right now. I mean, I’ve had thoughts of doing that because I still feel a lot of pain right now, but this past month, what I’ve chosen to do so far is I jumped into reading and started working out and exercising. So far, that’s what I’ve been doing at this point.

Okay, how’s your child doing?

He’s doing great. He’s doing great. He seems to be doing fine. Emotionally, I still have contact with him. I’m in the process of setting up joint physical and legal custody. I’ve spoken with the mom about this joint legal and physical custody thing, and, you know, she seems to be on the same page with it. There doesn’t really seem to be any problem there.

So you don’t think you’ll have a bad custody battle or anything?

No, that’s okay.

Because the reason I asked that is, as a dad, if you’re trying to put your life back together and you’re wondering whether you should date or how soon you should date afterwards, one of the main things—if you went on and jumped into another relationship and abandoned your son—the guilt that you would feel from that would be, should be, enormous. Because what happens with the kid is that the two things they fear most, or that are most damaging to a kid—and I can’t speak for every kid, obviously—but the two things in a divorce or separation situation that really are troubling to a child... Do you want to take a stab at it?

I guess, troubling to a child? Yeah, I would say the parents having a lot of conflict.

Yes, that’s one. Do you want to try another one?

The other one, I would say, not being able to see the child.

Yeah, abandonment. Abandonment by one parent or both parents, where they just feel like they want to move on in their life and start a new relationship, and the child represents baggage from the old relationship. And even though you don’t want it to feel that way, it does feel that way. You really want to get help if that’s the case. You haven’t said that’s the case, but if you have any of those feelings, keep it in. Try to see it from your son’s eyes, and see that he’s a unique individual. And I think that you will heal faster—you talked about the pain—if you feel like a strong parent.

Now, in terms of dating, is there a woman that you’re interested in?

Well, there is a woman that I have had in mind. I mean, we haven’t spoken in a long time, but I’m just kind of nervous about even doing that right now, because, like I said, I’m still feeling a lot of pain from the other relationship. I’m kind of nervous about even jumping into that. I saw a quote online from another specialist that said, "You cannot attract a partner who is healthier than you."

Yes, yeah. Well, you can, but it’s going to be hard for that person to admire you. You know, if they’re looking for a soulmate, if they want to assume a caretaker role, or if they want to assume a parental role, then you’re carving out a different type of relationship. The pain you’re talking about—who left whom?

Hey, I’ve got to interrupt this because we’ve got to pay some bills. Thirty seconds, that’s it. A very quick ad, and we’ll be back.

Romance. I wish I knew more about what girls want from a relationship. Boy, I wish I knew more about what I want. Where’s that ad I saw? Here it is: The Selfish Path to Romance, a serious romance guidebook. Download chapter one for free at selfishromance.com and buy it at amazon.com. Huh? The Selfish Path to Romance. That is interesting.

The pain you’re talking about—who left whom?

Oh, well, she actually initially left me.

She left you. But you went back and forth a bit, because you said "initially."

Yeah, we did go back and forth a bit. We got back together, we separated, got back together, and then finally, it just... you know, it just ended.

And if your pain could speak, what would it say? What’s the essence of your pain?

Well, abandonment, I feel.

Okay, so you’re going through it yourself.

Yeah.

Okay. Hurt. Did she catch you off guard?

Kind of, yeah, yeah, kind of, yeah.

Well, another issue that kind of confuses me is that, you know, not only did she catch me off guard, but it’s been about 30 days, and she’s in another relationship already.

Okay, so she moved on.

Yeah.

Did she already have that in the background while you guys were still together?

No, it’s just, you know, I know that it’s new.

Okay, in the background, it’s very new.

So you feel replaced, yeah, it’s not just tossed aside. I had a babysitter once who gave me a very negative image about dating. Luckily, I never held onto that, but she said, "Men are like a box of Kleenex. You pick one out, use it, throw them away, pick another one out." Awful imagery, huh?

Yeah.

So, luckily, I never kept that. I’ve been married for... I’ve stopped counting. Very happily.

I don’t want to do that, yeah, so you want to have a much better image, and you don’t want to abandon your son, and you don’t want to abandon someone else even closer than your son. Guess who that is?

Me.

Yes.

And also, I don’t want the next relationship that I get into to involve us, you know, emotionally or verbally hurting each other. I don’t want to go through that.

Right. So you want to put yourself together. You don’t want to abandon yourself. You want to process all of the pain that you’re going through, or at least the essence of the pain. You started to do it talking with me, but this obviously isn’t therapy. If you wanted to, you could find a cognitive therapist or a good therapist nearby. It may pay to go to a couple of sessions just to process the pain you’ve gone through so you don’t end up carrying it unprocessed. Otherwise, you’re just setting yourself up for more pain. In terms of dating, you want to feel like you’re comfortable with yourself. You don’t want to be leaning on someone else. Plus, you’ll be introducing your son to someone new.

You know, it really depends on the full context. I can tell you, I broke up with a guy when I was in college. I don’t know if he broke up with me or I broke up with him. See? Over time, details like that you forget. But we ended the relationship around Christmas, and I promised myself I wouldn’t jump into another relationship. Now, we didn’t have kids, and I found I dated during that holiday season. On January 2, a guy asked me out. And guess who that guy was?

Your husband.

My husband. So I ended up dating within a week, but it ended up positively. However, with you, I think you need to give yourself more processing. Your own ambivalence is some evidence of that. Then, you know, you can go to a coffee shop with this woman, maybe get to know her. Just be good to yourself first.

Listen, thank you so much for the call. You can also check out my book, The Selfish Path to Romance: How to Love with Passion and Reason. That means you value yourself, which is what you’re looking for, and your partner. You can find it on amazon.com. Ronald, thank you so much.

Thank you.

You’re welcome.

And here’s a little more from Dr. Kenner:

I just moved in with my son, and it ain’t working. There’s a lot of tension between us. I guess I didn’t see that he had a whole new life planned for himself, and I kind of got in the way.

And that’s from Frasier. If you’re a parent of a grown kid and you’ve moved back in with them, like Dad has with Frasier, you may anticipate, "Oh, this will be wonderful. I can reconnect with my kid, and we’ll have good times, and we’ll have that bond we never had before." Maybe that’s the case, or maybe you have a rude awakening. Your child has his or her own life, and you’re an intrusion on that life. Your expectations weren’t what your child expected. Maybe they expected you to have a more limited role in their life. How do you deal with all of the undercurrents in these types of relationships? How do you make them not undercurrents, but openly communicate about what each of your needs are, and find a way to compromise so that neither of you feels taken advantage of?

For more Dr. Kenner podcasts, go to DrKenner.com.

Here’s an excerpt from The Selfish Path to Romance by Dr. Ellen Kenner:

Is romance possible with an abuser who abuses only sometimes? No. Abusers may initially act nice to con their partners into a relationship, then gradually escalate their abuse, insidiously undermining the confidence and trust of their partners until none is left. Abusers do not value their partner’s happiness because they don’t value themselves. Their goal is destruction. Frequently, a partner will put up with abuse or bad behavior because the abusive partner sometimes acts in a respectful, considerate manner. The victim rationalizes that the abusive behavior is not the real him or her. This is an unfortunate mistake. Abusive behavior is just as much a part of that person’s character as the considerate behavior—a very dangerous part, because unless corrected, it always undermines the rest.

You can download chapter one for free at DrKenner.com, and you can buy the book at amazon.com.