The Rational Basis® of Happiness Podcast

The conversation features a discussion on dealing with depression and negative thoughts. Dr. Judy Beck, a cognitive therapist, advises identifying specific situations where negative thoughts occur, such as at work or in a marriage. She emphasizes evaluating the accuracy of these thoughts by considering both positive and negative evidence. For example, Ellen, the speaker, feels inadequate at work but also receives positive feedback. Dr. Beck suggests focusing on positive actions and recognizing them to counteract negative thoughts. She also recommends resources from the Beck Institute and the Academy of Cognitive Therapy for further help. The segment concludes with practical advice on managing negative self-talk and maintaining a balanced perspective.

Action Items
[ ] Check out the Beck Institute website at www.beckinstitute.org.
[ ] Explore the resources available on the Academy of Cognitive Therapy website at www.academyofct.org.

Outline Introduction to the Program and Dr. Judy Beck
Unknown Speaker introduces the program and mentions downloading a chapter for free at DrKenner.com and Amazon.com.
Speaker 1 expresses feelings of depression and a sense of life being pointless.
Speaker 2 introduces Dr. Judy Beck, highlighting her credentials and her new book "Cognitive Therapy, Basics and Beyond."
Dr. Beck is welcomed to the program by Speaker 2.

Identifying Specific Situations of Depression
Speaker 2 asks Dr. Beck for help with negative thoughts and feelings of inadequacy.
Dr. Beck suggests identifying specific situations where these thoughts occur, such as work or marriage.
Speaker 2 mentions feeling inadequate at work and being compared unfavorably to cheerful co-workers.
Dr. Beck emphasizes that depression involves negative thinking, which is often not entirely true.

Evaluating Negative Thoughts
Dr. Beck explains the importance of evaluating automatic negative thoughts to determine their accuracy.
Speaker 2 lists evidence of feeling inadequate, such as arriving late, getting frazzled, and making mistakes.
Dr. Beck points out that these are common human experiences and asks for evidence of positive performance.
Speaker 2 acknowledges positive feedback from co-workers and customers, indicating some competence.

Balancing Positive and Negative Experiences
Dr. Beck highlights the importance of recognizing both positive and negative experiences.
Speaker 2 admits to focusing on negative incidents, such as delivering the wrong order, which leads to depression.
Dr. Beck suggests looking at the entire picture and recognizing all actions, not just mistakes.
Speaker 2 agrees that focusing on positive actions could help reduce depression.

Practical Steps to Reduce Negative Thinking
Dr. Beck advises being conscious of positive actions throughout the day to counteract negative thoughts.
Speaker 2 agrees that recognizing good actions could help improve self-perception.
Dr. Beck summarizes the process of evaluating negative thoughts and balancing them with positive evidence.
Speaker 2 thanks Dr. Beck and asks for information on resources for cognitive therapy.

Resources and Conclusion
Dr. Beck provides information on the Beck Institute and the Academy of Cognitive Therapy.
Speaker 2 thanks Dr. Beck and concludes the segment.
Speaker 5 promotes a book called "The Selfish Path to Romance" and its availability for download and purchase.
Speaker 2 reads an excerpt from the book, emphasizing the importance of moral character and emotional response in relationships.

Keywords
depression thoughts, cognitive therapy, negative thinking, problem solving, automatic thoughts, evidence evaluation, workplace inadequacy, positive feedback, mind focus, emotional recognition, relationship advice, moral character, praise criticism, soulmate qualities, romance guidebook

The Selfish path to romance.
Download chapter one for free at Drkenner.com, and at Amazon.com.
Aren't you going back to bed?
No, I'll just sit up for a bit. I'm feeling a bit blue.
Anything you'd like to talk about?
No, no, you need your sleep. It's nothing important, just this feeling that my life's a gaping sinkhole, and I'm just marking time while the flower of youth rots on the vine.

What do you do if you have a lot of thoughts just bouncing around in your head like, oh, I don't know what I'm going to do. I just feel down in the dumps. I'm depressed. I don't know how to get myself going. There's just no motor there. What do you do with those thoughts? Most people just let them simmer, and it brings them down even further. They get more and more depressed. Well, with me today, I have the absolute pleasure of introducing Dr. Judy Beck, who is the director of the Beck Institute for Cognitive Therapy and Research, and she's the president of the Academy of Cognitive Therapy, where there are wonderful resources that any of us can go to and download, and we'll get to that in a moment. She's also the clinical associate professor of psychology and psychiatry at the University of Pennsylvania, and she's written books and done many, many workshops nationwide and internationally, and her new book is Cognitive Therapy, Basics and Beyond, with a foreword from the father of cognitive therapy, her real-life father, Dr. Aaron Beck.
Welcome to the program.
Thank you, Ellen.

Dr. Beck, if I'm feeling depressed like that, and these thoughts are just rolling around in my head about how I just don’t know what I’m doing. I feel so bummed out that I can’t get myself going. What would you do with all of these negative thoughts that I’m just rolling in?
The first thing that I would do is find out a specific situation in which you were having these kinds of thoughts and feeling distressed.
At work and in my marriage, right?
I might give you the choice then— which would you like to talk about first?
At work.
Okay, did these kinds of thoughts come up this week at work?
They came up a lot.
Can you remember one particular time when you were feeling really depressed at work?
Well, I just felt very inadequate. I see my co-workers—they're cheerful. They answer the phone with a smile on their face, and I just say hello. I just don’t feel like I’m doing my job well, and so I feel inadequate. I feel very depressed right now.
It's very important to realize that a part of depression is negative thinking. Everyone in the world who is depressed has negative, depressed thoughts. The good news is that oftentimes these thoughts are not true, or certainly not completely true. So what I’d like to do now is teach you how you can evaluate an automatic thought like this and find out: is it true? Is it not true? Is it somewhere in between? And then do some problem-solving about it. Would that be all right?
Yes, that'd be fine.
Okay, so let's look at this thought: "I’m inadequate." Tell me, the first question that I would ask you is, what’s the evidence that you’re inadequate?
Well, sometimes I arrive late to work. It's only like five or ten minutes late, but it’s still late, and the person I work with is there right on time. Sometimes I just get frazzled. I work at a restaurant, and if I’m a little bit late, it throws everybody off. It throws their schedules off. And then sometimes, when I try to help—I’m the receptionist, I answer the phone there, but I also sometimes pitch in and help the waiters and waitresses—I just feel like I don’t know. Sometimes I’ve delivered the wrong order to somebody. So there is evidence that I just feel inadequate at what I’m doing.
So far, it sounds like this: Sometimes, not every day, you arrive late, which many of us do. Sometimes you get frazzled, which almost everybody I know does. And sometimes you make mistakes—again, a pretty human condition. Can I ask you this, Ellen, is there any evidence on the other side that maybe you're not inadequate, or certainly not completely inadequate?
Well, they were very excited to hire me. They think that I present myself well, that I’m very welcoming to people, even though I can stumble on the phone occasionally. And I think the waiters and waitresses are happy that I pitch in, even if I occasionally blunder.
I see. So there are some things at work that you do well—you present well, and you're welcoming, which is probably the most important part of your job, right?
Yes, and I'm very good with children.
Oh, and you get a lot of kids at the restaurant?
Not in the later evenings, but during early evenings and on weekends, yes, we do.
Well, that’s important. I have to tell you, not everybody is good with kids in a restaurant.
Oh, I just get down on the floor with them sometimes and play, and I have a lot of fun.
It sounds to me as if, from what you're saying, even if you make mistakes, the waiters and waitresses are actually glad for your help. I imagine they wouldn’t be if you were doing a totally inadequate job.
No. You know what happened the other day? Someone got really angry with me because I delivered the wrong meal. Not only did the customer get angry, but the waiter got really angry too.
I’ve got to interrupt this because we’ve got to pay some bills—30 seconds, that’s it. A very quick ad, and then Ellen will be back.

Romance. Oh, I wish guys knew more about what we want from a relationship. Boy, I wish I knew more about what I want. Where’s that ad I saw? Here it is—The Selfish Path to Romance, a serious romance guidebook. Download chapter one for free at selfishromance.com, and buy it at Amazon.com.
Hmm, The Selfish Path to Romance—that is interesting.
And not only did the customer get angry, but the waiter got really angry too.
Is it possible that you’re preoccupied with that incident and not recognizing all the other things you did well that week or that day?
Oh, that’s absolutely going on. But how can you not? If somebody yelled at you, isn’t that the only thing that comes to the forefront of your mind?
Well, it’s very normal for it to come to the forefront. But another thing you can do for yourself is to say, “Okay, that’s true, but let me look at the entire picture. What else did I do today? What else did I do this week at work?” Do you see how it’s not realistic just to look at one situation? It’s so important to look at the whole picture.
So you’re saying that if I let my mind focus on the things that I just take for granted—the good things—that would help me?
I think it really would help if you recognized all the good things you’re doing.
How would I do that, though?
One thing is to be conscious as you go through the day of the things you’re doing. And my guess is that there are dozens and dozens of those things. So, let’s say a customer comes in, and you greet them nicely. It’s important for you to say to yourself, “Okay, I did that well.” Let’s say you help a waiter out and don’t make a mistake. It’s important for you to say, “Okay, I did that well,” and go through your workday recognizing all the things you’re doing—not just the mistakes.
I think that would help me.

I’m with Dr. Judy Beck right now. Dr. Beck, how would you phrase what we’re doing?
We’ve been evaluating an automatic thought—a negative, depressed thought that’s making you feel really bad. When we evaluated it to see how accurate it was, we found out it’s not accurate.
Right, it was way off base. I played the role of a waitress, and you helped me see that if I collect evidence—although my mind is focused on the negative incident of the week—if I collect all the evidence, I’ll see that I’m very competent, I’m very good at what I do, and I’m well-liked. I shouldn’t let one negative moment pull me down into a depression.
That’s exactly right.
I want to thank you so much for joining us today, Dr. Judy Beck. Can you provide some information on how people can get in touch with the Center for Cognitive Therapy?
The best way is probably to check out our website at www.beckinstitute.org.
If they wanted resources, what would you recommend?
Another good website is www.academyofct.org (Academy of Cognitive Therapy).
Thank you so much for joining us today.
Thank you.

For more Dr. Kenner podcasts, go to DrKenner.com.

Here’s an excerpt from The Selfish Path to Romance, the serious romance guidebook by clinical psychologist Dr. Ellen Kenner and co-author Dr. Edwin Locke:
If you are interested in finding a potential soulmate, be on the lookout and eliminate anyone with poor moral character—for example, someone who is dishonest or lacks integrity. No matter what other qualities he or she possesses, and no matter how good that person makes you feel in the short run, such a person will bring you nothing but heartache and disappointment in the end. Eliminate anyone to whom you do not respond emotionally, including sexually—love, after all, is an emotion. Notice how your partner treats you. For example, if the person is stingy with praise but generous with criticism, dump him or her.
You can download chapter one for free by going to DrKenner.com, and you can buy The Selfish Path to Romance at Amazon.com.